Ideas for a 3rd faction?

[thewaywardone]

Hey all!

One of my favorite things about End of Nations is that, if implemented as Petroglyph and Trion were originally envisioning, it would be not just an RTS/tactics game, but a platform on which to deliver additional content over time. New units, heroes, mods, skins and even maps (we saw how easy it was for them to turn maps on and off without requiring a game update) over time.

But, it'd also be relatively easy (depending on how the meta ends up working) for them to add new factions. Personally, I hope to see the first new faction enter the game between 12 and 18 months after release (again, assuming Trion keeps supporting and developing for EON after they launch it) and for them to release a total of 3-5 factions (I feel like 6 or more would be excessive though I'd be happy to be proven wrong)

According to Faction Calculus on TVTropes (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.ph...actionCalculus) the 3rd faction would probably end up being either the Powerhouse or the Balanced (I feel that the Shadow Revolution is still placed as the Subversives in this case). Either way, I look to the Order of Nations itself for a good initial 3rd faction.

Honestly, if the Order were added, you'd probably still be able to do existing missions without having to rewrite the campaign much. Player Order units could be retconned in as something of a "secret police" or "special forces" branch of the Order, who are tasked with "testing" or "winnowing" the weak of their own government at the same time as controlling and corralling the efforts of their guerilla fighter enemies. Player Order actions against NPC Order could be seen as necessary towards their larger goal, and NPC order missions like Last Stand or even Hold the Line could be explained as the NPC order commander confusing Player Order forces with the SR.

Indeed, the Player Order could be expected to do weird things like save civilians from the larger Order... Imagine if they're trying to find LF or SR bases, and have "planted agents amongst the refugees" - holding their brethren off helps them get their agents under cover. There could even be alliances between Player Order commanders and LF/SR commanders - they could claim to be defectors, working towards nefarious and clandestine ends.

Anyways, I think seeing players being able to join the Order and fight for them would be awesome.

I also think that there could be a post-apoc cyberpunk faction. Think the player-made Forgotten from the C&C games. They would be free peoples, living under the radar of the LF/SR/Order. Think the town from the End of Nations comics - they'd be homesteaders, living in bombed out cities and deep in the wilderness, fighting in small numbers and with outdated scrapped together technology against the overwhelming tech and force of the 3 major factions. I could see suicide units, Ewok-on-Endor style dumb traps, GLA-style Scap tanks that get stronger as they kill enemies and acquire their weapons (looting a Shiva cannon on the battlefield BOO YA)

What about you all? Thoughts?

[NodDragon]

I think it could be quite good to have a 3rd faction, since maps can´t that easily end up belonging just to one faction as we saw in the beta. Also that with Shadow and Liberation you always fight the great evil known as the Order of Nations, but it could be fun to fight as that great evil.
But I think that if they add other factions, they shouldn´t be to close in play-style as the Shadow or Liberation, and should be based around other things then the stealth/speed and health/slow thing they got right now. Maybe a infiltration factions which had the ability to make they own units look like the enemies units. Just something that doesn´t feel like the two factions the game got right now.

[Riddle6]

post-apoc cyberpunk faction. Think the player-made Forgotten from the C&C games. They would be free peoples, living under the radar of the LF/SR/Order. Think the town from the End of Nations comics - they'd be homesteaders, living in bombed out cities and deep in the wilderness, fighting in small numbers and with outdated scrapped together technology against the overwhelming tech and force of the 3 major factions. I could see suicide units, Ewok-on-Endor style dumb traps, GLA-style Scap tanks that get stronger as they kill enemies and acquire their weapons (looting a Shiva cannon on the battlefield BOO YA)

Intresting. They will certainly be needing a 3rd and maybe 4. Faction to keep the game intresting and to make it appeal to as many as possible.. A Faction made from Scrap metal who uses what they have at hand, Old school Fire power and so on Old Prototype tanks and so on.. Would be my Choise when going to war in this game. But old school weapons often packs quite a Punch im tinking Red Alert Soviet Style Outdated But Damn they Hit you hard and Brutal when they Hit! (I'm all in for A Out dated Army!)

[libbmaster]

When I first heard it, the concept of EoN being a "platform" for new content really, really appealed to me. I would love to see the game get that kind of dedicated treatment from the devs, and would add a whole new level of enjoyment to the game (What will they introduce next?). Thanks for bringing that up!

That's also a very convincing argument for having the order as a third faction. I always figured that would break the story, but the "secret police" concept fits... surprisingly well. It would be rather interesting to see how a human commander utilizes units intended for the NPC's. But, perhaps the units the player has access to are not the default OoN units? (Oh the possibilities!)

As for the "scrap faction"... the idea seems slightly cliche to me. That said, it would totally fit with the universe. Perhaps more importantly, it might force a deeper look at the other factions political beliefs and back stories. I always thought EoN's factions would really benefit from a "grey area" treatment, where no side is presented as absolutely right or wrong and both have fully fleshed out back stories detailing how they create, organize and sometimes break their own political/moral stances. The existence of a third, unhappy group of freedom fighters might give the two existing factions the material needed to define their place in the world.

(P.S. When EoN first started rolling out the factions, they looked a lot more like what I just mentioned! I'd like to see a return to that "grey area" style. Anyone else have thoughts on this?)

[DoomBunny]

Well, the secret police or "renegade" ideas are both very cool, but the SR and LF cover such wide swaths both thematically and dynamically its hard to think of what a new faction could focus on that isn't rehashing old ideas.

The best I've come up with is the "theology" based faction. A bit nutty, but let me explain.

We already have the Capitalist, Democracy, Freedom-at-any-cost, Uncle Sam's army-type faction with the LF. Then we have the Socialist, Order, Keep-the-world-running, Illuminati wannabes with the SR. The only "major" political influence we have yet to see is the good 'ol Church and other such affiliates. Focusing more on this and older powers (lets throw some aristocrats in there) lets players get the "feel" of the ON (take over the world) without the issue of trying to explain why the ON apparently can't differentiate its own commanders. Having a "Crusader" faction focused on an army of zealots and preachers could be cool, or backfire.

Unit design would be the most obvious hurdle. SR covers swarm, light, high technology, stealth and any other such "Black-Ops" unit., while LF has everything else that shoots, explodes, flies, rolls, or generally breaks things. That doesn't leave a lot of room for creativity, but there still some room.

Units that focus on spells or passive effects as the main source of performance rather than raw dmg/hp/speed could lead to a dynamic playstyle, while making sense thematically (bringing a preacher makes your crusaders stronger). Alternatively, more varieties of spell-casting units to mix in with the "generic" troops could offer a playstyle akin to Protoss or caster-type characters some players may like.

I'm thinking a mix of balanced units with a lot of support/spellcasting units would form the main core, with a couple of fun units thrown in. (WOLOLOLOLOLO optional).

The other big hurdle is making the units look like they make sense. Having a bunch of dudes in robes running around with Bibles and hand grenades would be....awkward. Unit design would need to capture the aura of Medieval Age hierarchy in a modern setting. For example, a "knight" could be a heavily armored tank with the ability to rapidly increase speed before entering combat, while an "archer" could be an artilllery weapon with high area of effect.

If it works, the whole idea could be very cool. Playing a group of sophisticated old world powers trying to usurp the new world order using advanced weaponry modeled on Medieval war machines is something I'm pretty sure no strategy game has tried. It also adds a bit more variety, SR and LF have very "basic" styles: Guerilla and Straight-up-Fight. "People's Crusade" (as I'm now calling them) would be able to have more advanced styles like focus on force multipliers, debuffing, specialized casters, etc.

The only thing that could REALLY go wrong with unit design is offending someone(s). Religion never goes down well in gaming, unless it's something from the past. Making sure any references were rooted in the Medieval Era and not modern times would keep the controversy away. That and just being tasteful. Having a giant infantry called "Goliath" is cool, a caster unit named "Jesus" is not ending well.

Of course this is just spitballing. The whole ON "Secret Police" could probably accomplish the same goal, but wouldn't be nearly as cool as having a massive artillery unit named "Warwolf".

[Guardian54]

Methinks the big hurdles would be to Introduce OoN, and then later introduce intra-faction matches (hey, Commander training has to be something more than that short tutorial, right?)

[thewaywardone]

Methinks the big hurdles would be to Introduce OoN, and then later introduce intra-faction matches (hey, Commander training has to be something more than that short tutorial, right?)

I hope that they include skirmish matches (for tournaments and for casuals) in the open beta of the new game. or at least for official launch

[brownUPStruck]

Intresting. They will certainly be needing a 3rd and maybe 4. Faction to keep the game intresting and to make it appeal to as many as possible.. A Faction made from Scrap metal who uses what they have at hand, Old school Fire power and so on Old Prototype tanks and so on.. Would be my Choise when going to war in this game. But old school weapons often packs quite a Punch im tinking Red Alert Soviet Style Outdated But Damn they Hit you hard and Brutal when they Hit! (I'm all in for A Out dated Army!)

I would kind of like to see the Scrap Metal faction. Commoners Fed Up with all three current factions. Those that have been living in the rubble get fed up with everyone else fighting, and more, and more people dying in something their not even directly involed in. They start out just taking up arms to defend their homes when the other factions come into town. Knowing that all that will be left behind is death, and destruction. Militas at first. Then they start to unite. Then... They rise up, and have their own go at the world. Using whatever leftover old tech they can find. That would be my take on it at least.

[brownUPStruck]

Well, the secret police or "renegade" ideas are both very cool, but the SR and LF cover such wide swaths both thematically and dynamically its hard to think of what a new faction could focus on that isn't rehashing old ideas.

The best I've come up with is the "theology" based faction. A bit nutty, but let me explain.

We already have the Capitalist, Democracy, Freedom-at-any-cost, Uncle Sam's army-type faction with the LF. Then we have the Socialist, Order, Keep-the-world-running, Illuminati wannabes with the SR. The only "major" political influence we have yet to see is the good 'ol Church and other such affiliates. Focusing more on this and older powers (lets throw some aristocrats in there) lets players get the "feel" of the ON (take over the world) without the issue of trying to explain why the ON apparently can't differentiate its own commanders. Having a "Crusader" faction focused on an army of zealots and preachers could be cool, or backfire.

Unit design would be the most obvious hurdle. SR covers swarm, light, high technology, stealth and any other such "Black-Ops" unit., while LF has everything else that shoots, explodes, flies, rolls, or generally breaks things. That doesn't leave a lot of room for creativity, but there still some room.

Units that focus on spells or passive effects as the main source of performance rather than raw dmg/hp/speed could lead to a dynamic playstyle, while making sense thematically (bringing a preacher makes your crusaders stronger). Alternatively, more varieties of spell-casting units to mix in with the "generic" troops could offer a playstyle akin to Protoss or caster-type characters some players may like.

I'm thinking a mix of balanced units with a lot of support/spellcasting units would form the main core, with a couple of fun units thrown in. (WOLOLOLOLOLO optional).

The other big hurdle is making the units look like they make sense. Having a bunch of dudes in robes running around with Bibles and hand grenades would be....awkward. Unit design would need to capture the aura of Medieval Age hierarchy in a modern setting. For example, a "knight" could be a heavily armored tank with the ability to rapidly increase speed before entering combat, while an "archer" could be an artilllery weapon with high area of effect.

If it works, the whole idea could be very cool. Playing a group of sophisticated old world powers trying to usurp the new world order using advanced weaponry modeled on Medieval war machines is something I'm pretty sure no strategy game has tried. It also adds a bit more variety, SR and LF have very "basic" styles: Guerilla and Straight-up-Fight. "People's Crusade" (as I'm now calling them) would be able to have more advanced styles like focus on force multipliers, debuffing, specialized casters, etc.

The only thing that could REALLY go wrong with unit design is offending someone(s). Religion never goes down well in gaming, unless it's something from the past. Making sure any references were rooted in the Medieval Era and not modern times would keep the controversy away. That and just being tasteful. Having a giant infantry called "Goliath" is cool, a caster unit named "Jesus" is not ending well.

Of course this is just spitballing. The whole ON "Secret Police" could probably accomplish the same goal, but wouldn't be nearly as cool as having a massive artillery unit named "Warwolf".

If they could find a way to fit this in their as well I think that would be great. The theology part of it. Ones who strive to restore peace threw purging all of the other fighting factions. Another OoN but with a new unfounded religous aspect.

Combine the Patriot, and Wraith subfaction playstyles into one.

[brownUPStruck]

Also another idea for a faction would be those that have just gone mad with all the war going on. Seeing no end in sight they have just lost it. Anarchy. They loot, and steal from the other factions, and rig the vehicles back up the best they can, and just want to wage war to destroy everything .First They start looting the other factions vehicles. Bring them in as a Non-Playable Factions like the OoN during their looting stage, and that way there could be more maps opened up. This would also give the chance for LF, or SR players to play agaisnt their own type of troops, instead of the enemy all the time. Then after a while once they start to devolpe their own tech, and weapons bring them in as a playable faction. No more goverments to rule over the people. No more Order of Nations. No more LF. No more SR. True freedom for them all.